BackerClub Forums

Dear members of the BackerClub,

Cave Pilot 55 is very proud to be welcomed on the BackerClub. At this moment we have 12 pledges from members of the BackerClub. We are very grateful for their support.

We are very curious though, why people seem to hesitate to pledge our Kickstarter project (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/15 ... e-pilot-55). Is it because of the shipping costs from the Netherlands to the USA? Or is it something else? We would appreciate it very much if you could give us some feedback about our project.

At the moment, we still have some time to optimize our project in order to make funding successful. We can, for example, explore the possibilities to produce our game in the USA, to lower the shipping costs for American backers.

We would like to thank you very much for your effort.

Warm regards,

Martijn en Suzanne Weterings

I don't think you should take particular offense at the numbers. If anybody told me a week ago I'd be backing a board game about flying around in a cave in a steampunk type plane, I'd have laughed at them.

The mechanics seem interesting to me (player alterations and size adjustment), but there are other BC members much more versed in gaming than me who could comment.

Whatever the mechanics are, it has to marry to a good visual aesthetic. Perhaps bats and steampunk are not as widely popular as one might think. Some people just shudder at bats.

If it was me, and I had a solid, interesting game mechanic, I would try to marry it to an 'old' property in disuse that's willing to license to get a ready made style that has a fan base. Example - the Thunderbirds (a currently active project).

If the focus is on the art/vision within, then ride it out and focus on marketing outreach to the right outlets. Only 1 review, and is in Dutch. Have you hit all the sites that can review and help you promote?

As far as cheaper US shipping goes, it couldn't hurt, but I don't think that's the only issue.

Good luck. I hope we make it.

--- Tom

I post in more detail on your backer page. It just didn't appeal to me or hit any of the things I'm looking for in a game. I can see bats & steampunk which is why I checked it out. But it wasn't what I was expecting. I'm not quite sure what I was expecting mind you. I'm more a reader than a gamer so I might have been expecting vampires or something as most steampunk I've read with bats would have vampires.

But as I said I'm not a gamer. I buy games as gifts or donations. This one didn't strike me for either of those uses.

More reviews by gaming blogs. Vids of people playing can help. More info in updates on cards & pieces might draw people in.

Dear Tom & Tasha,

Thanks very much for your feedback!
There are several reviews coming from Belgium, Canada & the UK. We will post them on our project page as soon as possible.
Greetings,

Martijn

Also wondering if a print & play version is viable. I know for a number of international games they frequently include that option. It's one way to deal with the shipping issue. I know you have all these cool parts but I've seen it done. I think a fellow BackerClub project (completed) Fujian Trader had one. I could be wrong I've got like ~150 projects live backed at the moment. If it's not that one let me know & I'll try finding a couple games I backed which did... Wading through my 750+ projects is a nightmare. YOU might be better looking through games in "completed" here for example of what I'm talking about before having me track mine down LOL

Dear Tasha,

Thanks for your reply. We are not planning to produce a print and play of Cave Pilot 55. We have an print and play on the project page just to accommodate backers to play our game and get a feeling of the mechanisms. Our final game will be a fancy boxed game with real components.
Greetings,

Martijn

Hello Martijn

I wanted to reply, since you posted the question here. I am generally not interested in games, so I don't even normally open game projects. I did skim through yours, because you posted here and I (for what little I know about games in KS) it looks great to me.

I think the shipping price is fair for an item of some size from Europe. I will admit that US backers often get by with the better shipping costs on KS and may be a bit spoiled in that sense and many Americans don't buy a lot of products from other countries, so we aren't used to high shipping costs for that reason. But many campaigns include shipping costs around the same range as yours or higher. I wouldn't discount the shipping costs if it will eat into the funding you need.

That said, one suggestion for future projects, if the shipping costs to the countries that you will be shipping to are similar, you may want to include the shipping cost in the basic pledge, instead of as an add on cost after a backer has chosen a reward. I admit that I have started to pledge for a reward on more than one occasion, where it said worldwide shipping and when I clicked to pledge and the cost I expected had doubled or close thereto, I rethought my pledge. I was prepared to pay X amount for the product based on the description and pledge pricing, but paying just as much for shipping it turned me off. Had I not been told how much of my cost was "shipping" I might have been ok with paying 2X or so the listed pledge price, if that had been the initial cost presented to me, and in my mind more of the $ went to the creator and less to shipping. It is a game of semantics, I know. But I hate paying for shipping and avoid it whenever possible.

I hope that is helpful. I wish you luck on your campaign.

Dear Rhonda,

Thanks for your feedback on our KS post.
Yes you are right, no one wants to pay for shipping and it is about semantics.
I think indeed that US backers normally get by shipping cost on KS. Fortunately enough the Dollar is quite strong compared to the Euro nowadays, as it hasn't been that low since a very long time.
Warm regards,

Martijn

I just took a quick look at your campaign and, unfortunately, unless something changes, I won't be backing above my current level of 1 Euro/USD. I was tempted to pledge for 28 Euros/30 USD, until I saw the shipping was an additional 20 Euros/21 USD.

It's not that I'm opposed to paying for Shipping, or even that Shipping is such a high percentage of the base Pledge. It's that the total (48 Euros/51USD) is simply out of my limited budget. (I'm on disability and cannot work so I have to be careful on which projects I back and for how much total per month.)

For my own project, I have been looking into ways to either bulk ship Rewards from my US manufacturer to a Fulfillment Center in the EU. It's looking like even with paying Customs/VAT myself, the overall reduction in shipping for, say, 50 Backers, everybody comes out ahead. I have also stumbled across a manufacturer inside the EU that could possibly print my playing cards there and either Drop Ship themselves, or ship locally to a Fulfillment Center for final distribution

Perhaps you can look into either/both of these methods for distributing to the Western Hemisphere and see if you can't reduce Shipping costs?

Also, it looks like Shipping for the 28 Euro tier is either 14 or 20 Euros, depending on specific country. Similar to the suggestion Rhonda T made, I might have made that tier around 42 Euros or so. Then your 14 Euro countries would have "free" shipping" and the rest of the world would "only" pay 6 Euros for their Shipping. (Actually, I would probably make the Tier 45 Euros, the extra 3 Euros providing a buffer for unexpected costs, and only listing 3-4 Euros for Shipping for the rest of the world.)

I hope the suggestions for "next time" aren't necessary, as this campaign ends up being successful for you.

Dear ShadowCub,

Thanks for your post. We will follow the Stonemaier option via Amazon.
Yes that is indeed a good suggestion. The next time we will include some part of the shipping costs in our tier, and distribute the costs more evenly.
Thanks for your trust in a succesful campaign!
Warm regards,

Martijn